When it rains, it pours

[selavia]

Well, if anyone has read my previous thread, you'll be up to speed on the fact that I have not been mentally all there lately and my mind has been other places. I was driving down my street today and I saw the cop that always sits there at the bottom of the hill. I was just about to decent the hill, and I left my car in neutral and rolled down the hill. I passed the cop like I always do, except he pulled out of his spot and begin to turn his lights on; I immediately came to a stop thinking he must have clocked me at slightly above the limit. He gets to my car and scowls at me that I "need to turn around and come to the top of the hill because you were doing 55! The speed limits 25! Turn around Now!" Then he proceeds to scold me saying that he sees me everyday and I know better. He then asks if "I'm okay." And I respond that "there is no valid excuse for my apparent speed." Just then my Dad drives by and he stops. My lucky day. The cop then started to be nicer when he realized I was upset about other stuff. He then told me to not only sign that I received the ticket, but he also told me to plead guilty. Here's where (I think) it gets interesting. I read what he told me to sign; it pretty much absolves him from showing up to court. I would want him there; right? I mean he told me, all he would say in court is that I was a nice kid who apparently had a lapse in judgement. THat would help me if he was there; right?
I feel like crud; not to mention the fact that look of disappointment on my parents faces. Who knows, maybe I'll get struck by lightening today.

 

[Big Daddy]

Were you doing 55? I cannot speak to attitudes being I was not there. What language is on the citation/summons that implies the officer does not have to be there? Was it a request for a court hearing waiving testimony? If you feel it was not deserved request a hearing and yes you want the officer there, if it was deserved you might ask for traffic school, or a witheld judgement.

 

[selavia]

I am completely and entirely pissed off now. I just looked online to see the point violation citations and I saw that for 10 miles over the speed limit you get two points, and for 30 miles over the speed limit you get 5 points. There is no increment for 20. I was almost positive that I was not doing 55, but he told me I was and I believed him! I usually drive on that street anywhere from 30-45 (depending on the time of day). I was probably going over ten miles, but not 30; he exaggerated. I thought I look at my spedometer just as Ireached the top of the hill (cause I was in third) and I could have sworn it was lingering around the 42. I am so mad now that I realize his motive. Ugh. I am definitely fighting this now.

 

[Bmw 325i 7803]

Goodluck, I'd get a lawyer and tell him everything you told us. Remember, contrary to popular belief and what the officer tells you, the Police are almost never there to help you. Based upon that alone, you shouldn't sign anything. Also if you pass the same spot where an officer always sits, wouldn't it be smart to know the limit and be sure to drive 25 if not 22 till the patrol car is out of sight. I realize your mind was elsewhere, but for the future the ticket writing police should always be on your mind. Goodluck again.

 

[Big Daddy]

contrary to popular belief and what the officer tells you, the Police are almost never there to help you. Based upon that alone, you shouldn't sign anything.

I totally disagree with both these statements. First off, just like most professions most police officers are very nice people who desire to help people everyday. And like I mentioned above I was not there, nor were you. I have a lot of respect for Sean, however we are only hearing one side a story. Sean will need to evaluate his situation and work from there.

Telling someone to never sign anything is a BIG mistake. If the offense is an arrestable one and a person refuses to sign a complaint and summons they can be arrested! Your signature is a promise to appear in court, nothing more.

 

[Bmw 325i 7803]

Well in the case where you can be arrested, then it's in your best interest to sign, but if you're recieving some kind of summons where the officers gleefully requests you "sign here" I certainly wouldn't do it. Also the police are public helpers I agree, but when you are supposedly in violation of the law and thereby "on the other side" now, when an officer says he is there to help you 99% of the time he isn't.

On the side note I'd rather take my chances with a lawyer getting the penalty reduced, than trusting an officer to speak well on my behalf, especially since he issued the citation. If your best interest was at heart, he would have issued a warning not a citation.

 

[Big Daddy]

For the most part your still wrong. Not signing a complaint and summons leaves the officer free to include in his notes on the citation for the judge that you were uncooperative and refused to sign. So now what does the judge think? I would also in the past write "refused" in the signature block. Again, all the signature is is your promise to appear, if you fail to promise to appear what might the jusge think of that.

I am not sure of the percentages, however I know that less than 50% of the time an officer is generating citations. In many large and small cities officers spend most of their time answering calls. In those cases he is there to help. So I do not believe your 99% time estimate.

I never suggested you than trust "an officer to speak well on my behalf", in lieu of an attorney. However issuing a citation vs giving a warning does not mean that he did not have your best interest at heart. And I have spoke well of the offender in court after having issued a citation and the judge took it into account when handing down a punishment. I only argue with your "99%" and "never" type of comments! Would it be fair to say that 99% of the lawyers never have your best interest at heart, all they are there for is the money?

 

[Bmw 325i 7803]

I'd say lawyers are in it for the money 100% of the time, but it is through their desire to obtain that money and future money that they put your best interest forward depending upon the type of case. Only you need to look at it from my standpoint, the NYPD isn't exactly your typical Police force. Infact, I wouldn't go as far as to say the majority of city cops are not here to help, but I would have a hard time saying they are as well.

When I go out of town I have to say I find state troopers, PA deputys and whatnot to be rather upstanding people and eager to help. I think it's safe to assume the same applies to WA. But the NYPD whether it's because of the disgusting nature of the average citizen they deal with or the fact that the police officers simply hate the job, they are clearly a bad example to use when representing the overall law enforcement field. Since I'm basing my post on the NYC attitude of law enforcement, I'll withhold further comment.

As for signing the citation, let me revise what I said about not signing it, if it simply says "signing this assures you will show up in court" OK, but what I really meant to emphasize was READING WHAT YOU SIGN and NOT SIGNING if it's not necessary.

As for the never comment, I think we both agree the police NEVER have the criminals best interest in mind. Unless we're arguing from the "punishment helps" standpoint. As for statistics I got another one for that "99% of statistics are made up on the spot" think how true that is. I'm done with the hijack...

 

[selavia]

I'm sorry, pulling up dead thread... (I was looking for a thread & came across this, so I wanted to post an update)

I went to court (some months ago); officer was there. I plead probation before judgment. Judge looked at me like I was crazy (b/c 55 in a 25). Asked the officers how I acted. Officer said alot of nice things about me. Judge shook his head, turned to me and said "have you lost your mind?! 55!" I apologized. He said, "I appreciate your apology, but I'd like it more if you'd slow down." He reduced the fine to $125 & no points!.

 

[frolf]

Booya!!!!!!!

 

[Big Daddy]

Good job! It pays to be polite!

 

[MrElussive]

I am glad it all worked out for you....I wonder why I never saw this thread originally, but glad it all worked out!

 

[epj3]

Nice, I guess I haven't posted about my 63 in a 35 last thursday.

 

[selavia]

Good job! It pays to be polite!

It sure does! Especially to someone writing you a ticket. My Dad always told me that, actually he says be nice in general, people tend to be more helpful and caring if your nice and treat them with respect they deserve.

He actually told the judge, "Never had anyone that sincerely apologetic and nice...actually made me feel a little sorry for issuing him a ticket."